VALUE for money and quality of programmes are both sore points with local TV viewers. So, when Gavyn Davies, chairman of the BBC since last October, visited Manchester this week, BEN feature writer Frank Elson tackled the thorny subject

WHEN Gavyn Davies was appointed the new chairman of the BBC some observers began to worry.

With a background in economics was Mr Davies going to be counting paperclips?

"Accountants count paperclips," he laughed, "economists count billions!

"I am not stopping anyone at the BBC from spending money but what I am doing is making the BBC more efficient.

"When Greg Dyke became Director General 24 per cent of the licence fee went on bureaucracy.

"Together he and I are going to reduce that to 15 per cent -- so that more of your licence fee goes on making programmes. We have already got it to something like 18 per cent."

Mr Davies likes watching television. He revealed:"I like Holby City and Eastenders, The Blue Planet and History of Britain -- and anything about sport."

But, as an economist and a socialist (who famously resigned from the Labour Party when he was appointed chairman) Mr Davies believes in value for money and is a believer in the "theology" as he calls it, of public service broadcasting.

Gavyn Davies did not set out to be involved in broadcasting. Born in 1950 he graduated in economics and by 1986 was an adviser to the 10 Downing Street Policy Unit under PM James Callaghan.

"I was the first person made redundant by Margaret Thatcher in 1979," he laughed.

His interest in television came when he chaired a government inquiry into the future funding of the BBC. He applied for the post of vice-chairman of the BBC and, when the chairman unexpectedly resigned, applied for his job and got it.

He is quick to his own defence when politics are mentioned, hence the resignation from the Labour Party. He said: "Both Greg Dyke and I are Labour sympathisers, but we were appointed by an independent body and are both completely devoted to keeping the independence of the BBC.

"There have been times when the Chairman and the Director General have been Conservatives -- and that did not hurt the BBC. It takes you over, Public Service Broadcasting is nothing if it is not independent."

Spending a couple of days in Manchester is also an important part of Mr Davies's views on broadcasting. He said: "The Governors were meeting in Manchester this week in a deliberate part of our policy to stop any regional bias within the corporation.

"I am taking the opportunity to visit the Commonwealth Games Stadium -- broadcasting the Games is very important to us. The BBC is the only UK broadcaster capable of handling the biggest sporting event ever to have taken place in this country.

"I will also be talking to local businessmen and arts people. The regions, and the North in particular are very important to us."

Something else very important to Mr Davies is the viewer or listener. He said: "People need to know that I appreciate that the Asian youngster walking the streets of Oldham pays exactly the same licence money as the Peer in the house of Lords.

"As far as I am concerned that gives him as much right to programmes as the man from the house of Lords -- yet it is His Lordship who stands up and tells us how to do our jobs.

"It is not just a matter of regional programmes for the regions -- although we are proud of the fact that, for instance our Look North West has ten per cent more viewers than Granada Reports but more a matter of programmes made in the North for national consumption.

"Look at the figures -- the North has soaps sewn up. Apart from Eastenders you have Coronation Street, Brookside, Hollyoaks and Emmerdale all from the North and all immensely popular around the country.

"However, whatever the facts there is a perception that the BBC is aimed at middle-class, middle-aged Southerners -- and mostly male at that. It isn't true but we need to make sure that people know it isn't true."

"There are two ways of looking at broadcasting today, with all the competition we have.

"On the one hand we have to work harder to justify the licence fee. It is more difficult because of the proliferation of channels, and people are watching less BBC because there is more choice.

"On the other hand it is becoming easier because people who pay subscriptions for TV -- £300 or £400 a year -- are saying that £109 a year for all that the BBC produces doesn't seem so bad at all."

Mr Davies is proud of the programmes which came from the North recently: Linda Green, Mersey Beat, and the Bolton-made Cops, and equally excited about the ones to come including Heart of the Valley, Stretford Wives and Cutting It.

"We have proved and are proving our commitment to the North-west," he said.

"Of course it is not just drama. The programme I Love the 1970s originated from Manchester -- an idea that has been ripped off by every other channel -- and we introduced Johnny Vegas and Bolton's Peter Kay -- two of the most exciting comic talents of the present day -- to national screens."

To the outside observer -- the TV viewer like you and me -- it hardly matters what channel shows a programme.

However, an hour in the company of Gavyn Davies helps to show that maintaining an independent BBC -- and funding it via licence fees rather than advertising -- helps keep all the channels in line.

And the final word from Mr Davies: "I go to a lot of public meetings and I always ask the question 'If you could keep that £109 in your pocket but lose the BBC, the sports, the news, the television drama and comedy, the local radio stations and the national radio, would you do so?'

"Do you know, no one ever says that they would rather have the £109."